Advice on Publishing and Finding an Agent?

[Darien_Shields]

Hi.

I, um, haven't been around here much before, but I was looking for some advice, and this seemed like a nice forum, so I thought I'd ask here.

I've written a couple of novels (about 70,000 words long), and had them sitting on my hard drive for a little while now, not sure what to do with them. I've tried looking into publishing, but I find it incredibly intimidating- I need to find an agent, and there are so many agencies, very few of whom, I think, will even give me the time of day. Most require print submissions rather than e-mail, and while I fully understand, I've never had good luck with printers, and could wind up paying a lot of money to mail manuscripts off to agencies who don't even want my genre.

I've been told that I should get my work professionally proofread, for a price. I am willing to pay money to try and work towards my book being published, but I just don't want to spend poorly, or wind up being scammed. I know there are a lot of unscrupulous people out there who will charge you an arm and a leg for proofreading they're never going to do.

I think genre is important to finding the right agent, so I'll give a little summary of the two books that I'm trying to get published. They are both science-fiction comedies, the first, Dread Pirate, revolving around the aspirations of a spacefarer who wants to become a pirate, but owing to his supreme bad luck, whenever he tries an act of piracy, he winds up on the right side of the law. The second is called "Bad Guys" and is an affectionate parody of superhero comics. The main character, Frank, is on death row, but an accident in his would-be execution accidentally grants him super powers. Despite his best attempts to remain low key and small time, he becomes drawn into a life of supervillainy, murky plots and backstabbing.

... I read those summaries back and think they sound absolutely terrible. I've had a fair few people read through these and gotten quite good feedback, but a lot of that was from family. Make of that what you will.

One last thing- I published something on Lulu.com before, and I thought it worked out fairly well. But a couple of people have warned me that if I do that with a story I may not be able to sell it on to a publisher, because there'll be a bit of a mess with the rights. Is that correct? I have thought of publishing one of these stories on Lulu before, so that I could have more to show for myself and try to get my name out there, but if it meant never being able to publish, that'd be rather a big drawback.

Anyway, I'll stop blabbing on. I really want advice, and I'd be incredibly grateful for any you would be willing to give me. Thank you very much.

 

[Darien_Shields]

Forgot to say, I am in the UK. I don't know if you can publish in the US without being a citizen, or whether agents would be interested, but I thought I'd say.

 

[WriterJohnB]

Darien,

I've been around the block a couple of times and I'll try to give you some quick advice, since it seems you haven't been googling to find out all this info, which is readily available. Agents? Try AuthorAdvance | The Writers' Community It'll tell you what agents are looking for new meat and what genres they represent. Print? Only a few agencies still require print submissions. They're the ones with top-notch client lists who aren't really looking for new clients anyway.

Getting an agent is pretty much hit and miss. I had an agent once, but she didn't do me any good. Mostly, agencies aren't interested in me, since I don't stick to a genre. I've sent a couple of hundred queries for various novels and got very little feedback. My daughter, who writes gay romance, got a top agent within a week, but he's not been able to find a home for her debut novel in more than a year. Google "how to write a query letter? and make sure it's damn good. If your novels require proofreading, it's even more important that your query has no mistakes.

Proofreading? Send me a chapter and I'll let you know A: if it needs proofreading B: If it's good enough to bother proofreading expense. I might be able to help along those lines, lower cost.

If you self-publish, agents won't touch you. Those who use LuLu, etc, are hoping someone will read their book, give a good review and sell enough copies that a major publisher will take note and pick it up. Exhaust your agent/publisher options first. Then look at minor publishers, who'll publish the novel at their expense, but don't give advances. I've published with Sam's Dot Publishing, Eternal Press, and Damnation Books, and self published one book to Amazon Kindle, which is free.

But FIRST make sure your novel is copy-edited and proof read. Find out if it's any good. (post excerpts on writing forums, perhaps. If there are errors, you won't make the grade. Finally, you need to work hard, getting published is harder than writing a book. You could find answers to most of these questions yourself by googling and following threads between sites. You'll become educated in how publishing works.

e-mail me a chapter and I'll give you an honest opinion. Warning, if your writing has problems or your plots, characters, etc. stink, I won't pull punches. But it's better to hear it from me than to keep sending it out and getting no feedback or worse, getting negative feedback.

Take care,

JohnB

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johnbushore@johnbushore.com



QUOTE]

 

[wolfnoma]

Forgot to say, I am in the UK. I don't know if you can publish in the US without being a citizen, or whether agents would be interested, but I thought I'd say.

Darien,

Ramsey Cambell has a good message board over there in the UK and the folks that visit there are quite helpful and friendly. Check them out.

 

[Darien_Shields]

Thanks for the advice John. I have googled this stuff, but I guess my google-fu is lacking. In the past I've either wound up looking at a list of agents that only take print submissions, or ones who won't publish science fiction. I will have to try harder in future.

For now I'll start with looking into AuthorAdvance, and otherwise get googling.

Sorry if I'm being obtuse, but are you saying sites like Lulu are a less desirable option than minor publishers, or publishing with Amazon? I'm not disagreeing, I just want to be clear.

I might post a little excerpt from something here and get opinions. I've posted work before, but in a really cloistered community that wasn't really geared towards critical response.

Thanks again for all your advice, and if I come off as lazy... maybe I am. I really need to get off my butt and get to work here, but every time I try I wind up drowning in a sea of potential options. But better to dive in and get some work done.

 

[Darien_Shields]

Darien,

Ramsey Cambell has a good message board over there in the UK and the folks that visit there are quite helpful and friendly. Check them out.

Do you mean the board at knibbworld dot com? I'd link it, but I'm not allowed to unless I've made 15 posts or more. Anyway, the board I found didn't look super geared towards giving advice on writing and publishing, but I'll take a look if that's the one you mean.

Thanks!

 

[wolfnoma]

Do you mean the board at knibbworld dot com? I'd link it, but I'm not allowed to unless I've made 15 posts or more. Anyway, the board I found didn't look super geared towards giving advice on writing and publishing, but I'll take a look if that's the one you mean.

Thanks!

Yes that is the one. Just ask any of the writers on there. All of them are pretty good about giving excellent advice all you need to do is ask them.

 

[WriterJohnB]

Darien,

Didn't mean to imply you're lazy, just to let you know that the info is out there and that getting published can be a lot of work.

Self-publishing (such as Lulu) still carries a stigma. Those firms are in it for the money they get from the author, so they'll publish anything without editing it. They also make money by selling the author print copies, so he can sell them, but offer no tangible marketing. A few years back, a self-publisher (Publish America) said that "anyone" could write science fiction because anyone can make things up. To show them up, a group of sci-fi authors wrote a purposely awful novel, Atlanta Nights, and submitted it to PA. They accepted it, but then backed out when the hoax was revealed. If you look around, you'll find that novel on line. Read it and you'll see what I mean.

Self publishing with Amazon, Smashwords and other free services don't take any money from you, but also don't edit for content. As a matter of fact, they don't even check formatting, which I found out to my chagrin when I downloaded my sample pages and found them all smashed together. They make their money on sales commissions. The downside? No print copies.

With minor publishing houses, they don't pay advances, but they DO front the expenses of publishing, including editing, proofreading, minor promotion, etc. So they only publish work they consider profitable. It's certainly a step up the ladder from self-publishing.

So it's all about what you, as the author, are looking for. If you just want a few copies of your work for relatives, friends, etc. (and maybe sell some copies) and can bear the expense, go ahead and self-publish.

But if you do that, the novel is considered "published" and agents won't consider it. If you want to become a big-time writer with that book, you'd better to hope for sales in the thousands, which could possibly be picked up by a publishing house for wider distribution.

Hope that helps,

JohnB

 

[WriterJohnB]

Okay, I'll take some of that back. I went and read the acceptance letter from PA for Atlanta Nights and they didn't want up-front money, just an agreement for buying a set no. of copies of the book, which is another way of charging for publishing.

Here's the link for "the sting." Critters Writers Workshop

JohnB

 

[Peter00]

Try Hubpages, Bukisa or Infobarrel. They are good publishing websites.

 

[elled]

advice about agents, etc.

Hi Darien

I am very new here but will try to answer some of your questions and as with all advice, you choose what to take on board.
Agent vs. publisher

It is very hard to get an agent, harder than a publisher in today's market due to the proliferation of small company e-publishers, some of whom also produce print books. I know a very successful YA writer who queried 140 agents until she got her first one. There are some big companies that will look at non-agent submissions, but very few while the small companies are more likely to look at your work. You need the latest editor of Guide to Literary Agents and Publishers. It's pretty much the Bible of writers and anyone else interested in the publishing industry.
You also need to be sure why you want an agent and what you expect of an agent. Agents today are highly selective and often, having a track record of publication does help. (not self-published) You had better know how to write a solid query letter, blurb and synopsis because the query is selling you as a writer and many agents do take electronic submissions today. Again, check that book and their individual websites. Same applies to publishers.

Professional proofreading. No writer should rely on someone else to do proofing. Proofing is not only checking for spelling and grammar but also all the other edits that are necessary--checking plot points, tensions, character development, scene progression, balance of narrative and dialogue. Only you can do that, not someone else and if you don't know how to do these things, then make yourself learn to do them. Get some solid critique partners--you always learn from reading work of other writers too. It's much easier to see flaws in another piece of work and once you become aware of those pitfalls, you learn to check your own for the same. And remember, conflict is the basis of any novel so it had better be there front and center, the sooner, the better.
Location of agent. In today's global market, the location of the agent is not an issue. I live in Israel, my publisher is in the US and if I do get an agent, the location will not be a consideration. What matters is the right representation for you and your work.

Genre I would not worry too much about genre. Concentrate on what I said earlier, crafting a technically sound book with a really original voice. Any good agent, editor, publisher can spot that in the first paragraph. And most of them won't read much further to confirm what they already suspect so it had better be there with a strong hook. Good writing is good writing, not the genre.
I wrote my first novel as practice to figure out how to write a book. Never figured anyone would see it so it didn't matter what I wrote. I thought I was writing a romance. Imagine my surprise when it was published and it has consistently been reviewed as a mystery. Doesn't matter really. What matters is that the reviews have been good, so stick to writing the best story possible and let the genre take care of itself.
Some advice I give to any aspiring writer
READ --DONT STOP I assume you want to write because you started out as someone who enjoyed books so why would you stop? Read for pleasure, read to figure out what works. How did that story hook you in, what made you have to turn that page, how realistic was the dialogue, how well did the author create a world that you find yourself immersed in, etc. Read every genre that you can. it will help you improve your writing immensely.
RESEARCH At some point, every writer has to conduct some research if the novel is going to be credible. Surfing the Internet is not research. Sorry, but it isn't. For research, you need to get to a good library, preferably a university library with solid and extensive holdings. You might not have to read an entire reference book, you might need to consult a number of them, but selectively. By that I mean, sometimes you only need to read one chapter from the book. It depends what kind of information you need, but I assure you, you do need to conduct that research in a library. Of course, it is possible that you may have to talk to people--ie you are writing a novel that features a pilot. Okay, if you know all about that profession, well fine. If not, you might need to talk to a pilot and perhaps specifically, a particular kind of pilot. (Commercial, private, military, jet, helicopter, small craft, etc.--you get my point here, but you will still have to read up on the subject.)
PERSEVERE Perseverance pays. The people who work at the craft of writing, consistently try to learn, accept constructive criticism and keep trying will improve and just possibly get published.
I hope this helps you

Elle Druskin