May 2013: Kathryn Stockett, The Help

[Polly Parrot]

Uh-huh, I wonder whether those people from the ABWH society read that part of the book as well.


Other than insisting that the novel really is just that, a novel, and not a historical account of any kind, the afterword also reaffirms the notion that the novel is much more about the coming of age of Skeeter.

The way that it is written, it also seems that the Skeeter character is loosely based on Stockett herself. She has the same trepidations about writing the book and she also moved to New York to pursue her writing career.

 

[Meadow337]

well they do say that the best thing to write is what you know. And I've heard it said that all writing is autobiographical to some extent or the other.

 

[Polly Parrot]

Something I just realised, when comparing book with film, Skeeter does not smoke in the latter. In the book she starts out as a smoker, not quite yet a chain smoker but she goes through a lot of cigarettes in the space of one day, especially when nervous or writing.


If I am not mistaken, she doesn't smoke at all in the film. I wonder whether that is because smoking in films in general is considered a no-no these days (if someone does smoke there is always somebody commenting on how they should quit because it isn't healthy, etc).

End of random point.

 

[Meadow337]

The whole thing about smoking in the movies is definitely a no-no these days although bad guys and gangsters may still smoke and if depicting a real person with whom smoking is indelibly associated. Winston Churchill and his cigars for instance.

 

[Polly Parrot]

I know. I never understand why though. I mean, it may be for reasons of setting the right example for the viewers and not encouraging smoking. On the other hand, however, it is perfectly accepted practice to see drinking in films where it is sometimes elevated to something that is "cool" and, more dramatically perhaps, shooting people and other acts of violence aren't exactly frowned upon, either.

One does always drive with a seatbelt on these days though. Most odd.

 

[smarie8691]

I am currently reading this, so I hope I could contribute soon to this discussion.

 

[Meadow337]

Sure thing! I'm know no-one will mind coming back and adding to the conversation again

 

[smarie8691]

Something I just realised, when comparing book with film, Skeeter does not smoke in the latter. In the book she starts out as a smoker, not quite yet a chain smoker but she goes through a lot of cigarettes in the space of one day, especially when nervous or writing.


If I am not mistaken, she doesn't smoke at all in the film. I wonder whether that is because smoking in films in general is considered a no-no these days (if someone does smoke there is always somebody commenting on how they should quit because it isn't healthy, etc).

End of random point.

There is actually one little quick part where Skeeter (Emma Stone) does smoke when she's in Aibeleen's home. It was a quick shot, and I remember Skeeter laughing while Aibileen was cooking. But other than that, they don't show the smoking like the book portrays of Skeeter.

 

[smarie8691]

I just finished the book. It was remarkable. The only thing I wish was that i didn't see the movie a year ago. I felt that it shadowed me with some areas in the text since I was expecting it to happen. Overall though, Hilly was such a B*%^&! I almost felt she was the center around everything. It was funny bc there was a part where Hilly and Elizabeth are talking and claiming they weren't racist. I thought about that. They were blind to the behaviors that they did to their help. I think because they weren't beating on the help or causing violence, then they weren't racist. In a way, they saw it as helping the help out since they were the ones giving them a job in the first place. I thought it was so interesting to see the different perspective of the help.

I also enjoyed how Aibileen was so involved with Mae Mobley. She didn't let Mae Mobley be influenced negatively, not only by her mother, but her teacher Miss Taylor. I loved the stories she would tell Mae Mobley, about how the exterior of a person doesn't matter, it's the character. I was wondering though, why does Elizabeth treat Mae Mobley so bad? My theory is that all these girls were very young, and maybe deep down that wasn't the kind of life they wanted, but society sort of had that forced path written for women- man at work, woman in the kitchen.

Minny was such a direct character. She reminded me of someone who if you asked them: "Do I look fat in this?" She would honestly tell you "Yes" or "No." I found it ironic how, as direct she was, even with the white ladies she was serving, it took her so long to stand against Leroy. I was so happy when she finally left, knowing that being with him any longer- considering all the stress with the book, would have been a toxic environment. I also enjoyed her complex relationship with Celia. I think Minny was not a very touchy-feely person, whereas Celia was, so Minny had to act like she didn't like it when in reality she really did appreciate it. I think Minny's view point of Celia truly changed when Celia beat the naked man that was running around the yard.

Overall, I felt the stress, especially once the talk of the book was going around Jackson. Overall, I think all the maids knew it was the right thing to do, and some sort of step towards a change. I also found interesting how Skeeter seemed to always have an underlying respect for the maids. I think that had to do with the love for Constantine. Connecting further, I am wondering if Aibileen was hoping that would be how Mae Mobley would act to future help- and just the future in general.

It was an excellent book, and I think it carried such an interesting topic. I truly felt I was in the early 60's. The language was exceptional. I could really hear these characters talking.

 

[Roxbrough]

I'm not sure if this is an appropriate comment to put, but I would like to thank the writers of this collumn for letting me know ahead of time that this is a book I do not want to read.
I am guessing the point of a book forum is to recommend material, but also to let readers know what they would 'not' like. So in this instance the forum has done it's job for me. Thank you to those who have read it.

 

[smarie8691]

I'm not sure if this is an appropriate comment to put, but I would like to thank the writers of this collumn for letting me know ahead of time that this is a book I do not want to read.
I am guessing the point of a book forum is to recommend material, but also to let readers know what they would 'not' like. So in this instance the forum has done it's job for me. Thank you to those who have read it.

No problem. I just started on this forum so the thanks goes to the others more than me. However, I am just plainly curious, what is it about the book that draws you away. I do NOT mean that in any negative way, for there are plenty of books that I had to turn my head too for the mere fact of dislike. I am just curious.

 

[Roxbrough]

No problem. I just started on this forum so the thanks goes to the others more than me. However, I am just plainly curious, what is it about the book that draws you away. I do NOT mean that in any negative way, for there are plenty of books that I had to turn my head too for the mere fact of dislike. I am just curious.

The whole race thing has been done to death [personal opinion]. Also when the dialog is not in gramatic English I find it a heavy going read. The club did it's job though and knowing what not to read is as useful as getting a recommendation, do you not agree?

 

[smarie8691]

The whole race thing has been done to death [personal opinion]. Also when the dialog is not in gramatic English I find it a heavy going read. The club did it's job though and knowing what not to read is as useful as getting a recommendation, do you not agree?

Oh ok. I didn't find the book to be a lot about race, more-so on the time period in general- that was just how it was. BUT to each their own. Glad you were able to decipher whether you liked it or not from the thread. That is another perspective towards reading reviews/discussions.

 

[Meadow337]

Yeah I think your assessment is accurate ... it is far more about how things just were back then rather than about race, and it is far more about the interpersonal relationships that were coloured by race to be sure and the tensions of the time. I think in that regard it reflects a way of life very well. I can relate to it having grown up in South Africa where every White middle class family had a maid who was in your home, in most cases regarded as a member of the family, raising the children whilst outside there was all this racial tension and riots and conflict. It seems almost schizophrenic in a way that on one hand you have White and Black in the same house so intimately whilst on the other hand you have all this tension. I can see in the book that it was much the same way then.

Not every one goes out and protests. Not every one is militantly angry about things, nor do they have to be to change things. It was like that for us. I can remember our maid arriving late for work at times and her reason was 'bus strikes' or 'the skollies (disaffected unemployed youth) were stopping us'. It just was a reality then. You just accepted that this was the way it was. Life went on. People had to work, to earn a living, to support their families.

 

[smarie8691]

Yeah I think your assessment is accurate ... it is far more about how things just were back then rather than about race, and it is far more about the interpersonal relationships that were coloured by race to be sure and the tensions of the time. I think in that regard it reflects a way of life very well. I can relate to it having grown up in South Africa where every White middle class family had a maid who was in your home, in most cases regarded as a member of the family, raising the children whilst outside there was all this racial tension and riots and conflict. It seems almost schizophrenic in a way that on one hand you have White and Black in the same house so intimately whilst on the other hand you have all this tension. I can see in the book that it was much the same way then.

Not every one goes out and protests. Not every one is militantly angry about things, nor do they have to be to change things. It was like that for us. I can remember our maid arriving late for work at times and her reason was 'bus strikes' or 'the skollies (disaffected unemployed youth) were stopping us'. It just was a reality then. You just accepted that this was the way it was. Life went on. People had to work, to earn a living, to support their families.

Very similarily, that was how I viewed it! Like you said, it was a way of life. But hey, not everything is everyone's cup of tea. That is interesting about your own life connection with the book. I can see that making much more sense to you personally since you encountered it face to face.

The only personal experience that is minutely related to this was I went to Georgia last year. My grandfather passed away so I had to check on some things. I am from CT so going to this small town was very different. I loved it though. It was almost like a different culture. I didn't know where my grandfather was buried so I went to a funeral home down the street. This town was so small so everything was right there. As a side note, half of my family is black, so it was extremely interesting to really understand where some of my family came from. As I went to the funeral parlor, this white man looked at me and then turned his head. Instead, he spoke only to my boyfriend (who is white) and said that the blacks have a separate funeral parlor. Being 2012 at the time, it was crazy to hear that. But I didn't get offended, things like that still remain segregated. So in a way, I felt that impression during the book- it was how it was. It was the personal relationships that were deeper.

Thank you for sharing your personal experience.

 

[Meadow337]

Very similarily, that was how I viewed it! Like you said, it was a way of life. But hey, not everything is everyone's cup of tea. That is interesting about your own life connection with the book. I can see that making much more sense to you personally since you encountered it face to face.

The only personal experience that is minutely related to this was I went to Georgia last year. My grandfather passed away so I had to check on some things. I am from CT so going to this small town was very different. I loved it though. It was almost like a different culture. I didn't know where my grandfather was buried so I went to a funeral home down the street. This town was so small so everything was right there. As a side note, half of my family is black, so it was extremely interesting to really understand where some of my family came from. As I went to the funeral parlor, this white man looked at me and then turned his head. Instead, he spoke only to my boyfriend (who is white) and said that the blacks have a separate funeral parlor. Being 2012 at the time, it was crazy to hear that. But I didn't get offended, things like that still remain segregated. So in a way, I felt that impression during the book- it was how it was. It was the personal relationships that were deeper.

Thank you for sharing your personal experience.

It is a little shocking to hear of such a blatant attitude in this day and age. And it makes me a little more sympathetic towards the anger some Black people in the US still have. I must confess to having a bit of 'get-over-it-already' attitude towards it because I just see the 'noise' they make and not what they are making noise about.

Whilst we still have some racial tension (like around every election time the hairy stinking old corpse of Apartheid gets dragged out and resuscitated for one more go around) but now a lot of it is xenophobia with immigrants from the rest of Africa being perceived as taking jobs away from locals, so that is Black on Black hatred. This is of course illogical but since when is fear logical? Some guy has the gumption to walk hundreds or thousands (in some instances) to get here, they are jolly well going to have the gumption to make a go of whatever opportunity they can create once they are here. The exact same opportunity existed before they made something of it, so if the locals don't use their get-up-and-go to get-up-and-get-going they can't be upset when some one else does. But nonetheless they do.

 

[smarie8691]

It is a little shocking to hear of such a blatant attitude in this day and age. And it makes me a little more sympathetic towards the anger some Black people in the US still have. I must confess to having a bit of 'get-over-it-already' attitude towards it because I just see the 'noise' they make and not what they are making noise about.

Whilst we still have some racial tension (like around every election time the hairy stinking old corpse of Apartheid gets dragged out and resuscitated for one more go around) but now a lot of it is xenophobia with immigrants from the rest of Africa being perceived as taking jobs away from locals, so that is Black on Black hatred. This is of course illogical but since when is fear logical? Some guy has the gumption to walk hundreds or thousands (in some instances) to get here, they are jolly well going to have the gumption to make a go of whatever opportunity they can create once they are here. The exact same opportunity existed before they made something of it, so if the locals don't use their get-up-and-go to get-up-and-get-going they can't be upset when some one else does. But nonetheless they do.

Very true. I understand what you mean. I have noticed that even Blacks will stereotype other Blacks which makes it a very vicious cycle. Very interesting to hear the more immigrant side of the story as well.

 

[Meadow337]

Yeah I've had the opportunity to speak to a few of them - their stories are incredible. I've spoken to immigrants from Somalia, DRC, and other places. They survive such incredible hardship to get here, there is no way with that will to survive that they are not going to succeed. The same drive that got them through life-threatening hardship to get here makes light of the 'hardships' of business. As a result they are often (although admittedly not all) very successful. And then resented for it. Africa still very much operates along tribal lines.

 

[smarie8691]

Yeah I've had the opportunity to speak to a few of them - their stories are incredible. I've spoken to immigrants from Somalia, DRC, and other places. They survive such incredible hardship to get here, there is no way with that will to survive that they are not going to succeed. The same drive that got them through life-threatening hardship to get here makes light of the 'hardships' of business. As a result they are often (although admittedly not all) very successful. And then resented for it. Africa still very much operates along tribal lines.

That is incredible to hear individuals stories on determination and going through triumph. It helps re-evaluate your own outlook on life.