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Thomas Mann & James Joyce

-Carlos-

-Carlos-

New Member
Joseph Campbell said that Thomas Mann and James Joyce were his teachers.

Writing prose upon a foundation of mythical tales - incorporating age-old fables, is at the very core of my creative writing.

Does such fiction sell well today? There must be a market for such work, right?

Fingers crossed as I await the replies. :whistling:

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I love mythology and how it touches people from all walks of life. And not to mention the scope of time. These (most) are ageless stories that tell of life lessons (for the most part), as well as produce spiritual awakenings and self discoveries that can not be expressed in any other way than through myths/lore (traditional wisdom).

A treasure chest is sitting right on your self: The Bible.

I recommend (HIGHLY!!) to read this book. I will widen your horizons:

aimages.barnesandnoble.com_images_26930000_26931108.jpg

I am now learning the marvels of the Inuit legends. This vital inclusion will fatten my prose with earthly, spiritual substance. The subject of mythology will add meat to my bony phrases. I will be able, if I handle things correctly, make the reader cry, laugh, or, for that manner, feel an array of emotions just by laying out the right tale; and dressing it up with a modern twist (the creative part) so that a wider audience can be satisfied.

That's my hope, for what it counts.

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Oh yes it does. They wrote (mostly) with myths as themes in their stories. It has everything to do with both writers.
 
I'm moving this to Author Discussion since it has nothing to do with writer's block.
 
AquaBlue said:
Oh yes it does. They wrote (mostly) with myths as themes in their stories. It has everything to do with both writers.
Click to expand...

OK then. Though I'm puzzled why you didn't post this in any of the existing Joyce, Mann or Campbell threads. But sure, at least with Joyce, you definitely have a point; Ulysses obviously riffs on Homer's story, and I'm told there's plenty of myth references in Finnegans Wake. As for Mann, I'm not so sure I'd agree when it comes to some of his work, though there's definitely some fairytale motifs in Magic Mountain - care to elaborate? What would you say are the similarities between these two writers?
 
Correct Beer. This subject does not apply to all the writings of Mann and Joyce. Nonetheless Campbell holds them in high regards as far as myth story tellers.
 
Well Beer...you must read some of those stories for yourself. How am I keeping you guessing. I am answering you concretely.
 
You started a thread on how Thomas Mann and James Joyce use myths in their storytelling, so I'm assuming you have something to say about it. So... how do Thomas Mann and James Joyce use myths in their storytelling, according to you or according to Campbell? Could you give some examples? Do you agree or disagree? What makes it work or not work? Which myths do they use? Why do they use them? What's the point of using mythical references in a story? Etc etc etc.

FTR, I have read several of the books, though it was a few years ago. Which ones have you read?
 
Sure...examples: I know (roughly) that Mann's Tonio Kröger and Death in Venice (I think), plus Joyce's Ulysses are a few I know for a certainty that are myth-type tales - so I have read in Campbell's books (The Power of Myth). According to Joseph Campbell those two writers have more than plenty of myth stories under their belts.

I am sorry Beer...I did not understand what you wanted as far as an answer. I hope these answers satisfy your requests.

I agree and yes it works: At least from my viewpoint. I love stories that teach and not just entertain, which is fine also. Myth teaches. So incorporating such lore into modern-day story telling would be, from my angle, a good idea that can work. So yes it should work.

I do not know which myths they use Beer. I would think a wide array of them. At least that's how I would go about it.

For me the point of using "mythical references in a story," is to add the element of life lessons and the virtues human nature that can draw in more readers into your work being that such myths (timeless and universal) are common, life-wise, to each of us.

Which ones have I read. To be frank I have not AS YET read any literature that uses myth as a foundation to story telling. But I have read Campbell and myths as stand alone subjects and not interpretations by such writers as Mann or Joyce. There you got me. But the point of the thread still stands on solid ground even though I have not gone into the literature portion of mythology.

I surely hope I have answered your questions fully Beer. Please feel free to ask as many as you like.

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I will, for a certainty, read every novel, novella, short story Mann and Joyce wrote. You can take that to the bank. I need to first do two things prior to writing my fiction: (1) read the biographies of both men after (2) studying all I need to understand about mythology as a whole. It will take time but so what...I'm in no hurry. My writing will be so much more worthy as a result (the dissecting of the subject(s) presented).
 
Now: The ONLY reason why I titled this thread the way I did - with the author names - was SOLELY because Joseph Campbell pointed them (Mann and Joyce) as his teachers. Hence I was eager to read replies from members who have been exposed to Mann and/or Joyce in the attempt to gain insight about their prose.

Now the title may be a blunder on my part, I'm uncertain (as far as precision)...but, if it is, it would be a trivial one because the title still leads one to the correct theme of the thread. Could I have chosen a better title, sure. But is the current title a bad one, not really.

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Have you read the actual myths which (somewhat) parallel or are the basis of the Joyce and Mann novels? If you haven't, you probably should since it would make reading the novel easier for you.
 
I'd think it a good starting point (reading the actual myths), considering you're into myth-based fiction. And reading the actual books rather than just a myth-book-for-dummies is a much better way to start. You can't go and make statements about a book you've never read.
 
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