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Do we learn from history?

Peder

Peder

Well-Known Member
Does any of this sound similar to the run-up to WWII in Europe and 'peace in our time'?

Putin Demands That Ukraine Pull Its Troops From Southeast
"Speaking with Angela Merkel of Germany on Thursday, President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia reportedly said Ukraine needed to initiate a “broad national dialogue” to resolve tensions."

Does anyone remember WWII?
Anyone read any history?
Jus' wunnerin'.
 
No. This is just another round of humanity's never ending quest to destroy itself.
 
It's in their sphere of influence, no one cares about the Sudetenland. They just want some "Lebensraum" If we negotiate, we can have peace. Just trust Neville.......er....uh....wait....what are we talking about?
 
They have an historical claim to the land going back at least 20 minutes. It's okay, really.

"In my hand I hold a document..."
 
Gita V.Reddy said:
Do we learn from history? We don't. That is why it repeats itself again and again....
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What we learn is don't ignore the obvious, the Ukraine is where the Russian Black Sea Fleet is based and the Ukraine has been a thorn in Russia's side since the middle of the last decade. Russia is consolidating it's strategic position.
 
The Russian bear has been hibernating. Now it has woken, and it is hungry.

And, from my recollection of reading Strategy by Sir Basil Liddell-Hart (paraphrased):

...What causes war? Peace causes war.
What causes peace? War causes peace...​

Meanwhile, some numbers: 2014 - 1939 = 75, two generations, plus. Fading memories of fading memories. :(
 
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Peder said:
The Russian bear has been hibernating. Now it has woken, and it is hungry.
Click to expand...

Most illuminating.

Sanctions have been applied to Russia over Sevastopol but no one's applying sanctions to the US over Guantanamo Bay, blatant international hypocrisy.
 
Peder said:
For a while, anyway.
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There's one nation that doesn't support the US with regard to the Russia/Ukraine crisis which is quite unusual for it as it usually supports American foreign policy, Israel...

I think history has a bearing here.
 
Conscious Bob said:
There's one nation that doesn't support the US with regard to the Russia/Ukraine crisis which is quite unusual for it as it usually supports American foreign policy, Israel...

I think history has a bearing here.
Click to expand...

Nooooooo comment.
 
Well, the Soviets didn't learn anything from the British in Afghanistan. And the U.S. didn't learn anything from the Soviets.

From a book I just finished:

Across the mountain range lay a polyglot population of Georgians, Armenians and Tatars, whose shifting loyalties had generated Russia’s most persistent frontier problem throughout the nineteenth century.
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...and twentieth and twenty-first.
 
Of course George let Osama escape out of Tora Borah because Iraq had weapons of mass destruction(sarcasm) When someone breaks into your car, that means you get to shoot up the neighborhood.

So East Ukraine pro-Russian agitators want to be annexed. If this movement is large and is politically viable, how do you not accept their wishes?

Not too worried about Soviet-Euro domination like the 1980s. They may fly Tupelov bombers off the coast of California, but they can't spend put out the manpower like they once did. The true challenger is further to the East................
 
Dredging now from deep memory, I can recall twice reading/hearing the thought that the reason we seem not to learn from history is that: each time the supposed same problem occurs, it is in reality different.

I believe Sir Liddell-Hart --mentioned above, I think -- wrote that "Every war is different."

And when an acknowledged expert on the causes of the Great Recession, and an esteemed economic adviser, said to the US Congress that he was "blindsided" by the banking collapse of a few years back, a knowledgeable friend of mine in finance explained to me that "It is different every time around."

So, yes, maybe some problems defy experience, as you say Bob.

In which case, maybe this thread is asking the wrong question after all, and should be asking something like "So, what can we learn from history re avoiding war?" If anything.
 
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Perhaps the question could be even broader. Do humans, in general, learn anything from the past?
If children cannot learn from the experiences of their parents or grandparents, who are hopefully their nearest and dearest, how can strangers learn from the past mistakes/experiences of people with whom they have no previous relationship, or even liking?

It doesn't seem to be within the human capability to learn from the past. At least not for the most part.
 
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