Vladimir Nabokov: Glory

[Peder]

And the very passage you quote above regarding Mrs. Edelweiss' grief was the one that made my stomach knot and the end was evident. I'd just forgotten rolleyes: ) exactly what had upset me.

Pontalba,
That pasage sure got to me also. It contains all the worries that a parent might have about how to protect their child from harm and it sounds so genuine.
As a clue, though, it is right out there, front and center. As is the story of Maritn's earlier encounter in the woods with the man with the gun. In his later novels Nabokov got much better at hiding his clues. But here, stated so clearly, I think they have clear implications for Martin's actual fate.

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Thats true, but there was also the firing squad bit, I can't put my hand to it right now, but it was the section where Martin speaks about how its a merciful thing that firing squads usually take place early in the morning, as that is when a man can face anything with open arms.
But if he had to die, your lifted scenario is kinder due to the speed of it, being over practically right away.

 

[Peder]

Similar endings

When I read the end of Glory it immediately reminded me of another famous novel, and as I have thought about it, I am further reminded of a historical spy story with a similar ending. With three examples now, it almost gets to sound like a standard ending.

John LeCarre broke new ground with The Spy Who Came in From the Cold, with an ending where the spy coming home ("in from the cold") is intercepted just as he is crossing the border

In American History, Nathan Hale was the man who had "but one life to give for his Country." In fact he was an American spy during the American Revolution who set out on an espionage mission against the British (sorry guys!) and was caught as he entered British territory and was executed. It seems he confided his mission beforehand in one person too many, a British spy.

And then, of course we see Martin talking with people about his own clandestine mission, and Sonia telling him to not blab it about so much. And he gets caught, we surmise, as he enters Bolshevist Russia. So Martin is in the traditon of spies who come to bad ends when too many people know of their intended missions.

In fact if one were to read the new style of espionage that is found in the novels of LeCarre, backward in time into the framework of Glory, then one might be led to believe that Martin was caught because one of the people he told about his mission was a double agent, also spying for the Bolsheviks. That person might of course be anyone or no one, because Nabokov gives no hints whatever that any such agent exists in Glory. However in LeCarre's world of double mirrors and ruthless double agents, the obvious person to suspect for causing Martin's surmised capture and death would be Gruzinov himself. He would be the classical model for a double agent: someone who crosses the border easily in both directions and, therefore, can easily arrange to work secretly for both sides. But that is not part of Glory. It is, however, very much the way John LeCarre would handle the story, and then end up with a story very much like his own sensational novel, The Spy Who Came in From the Cold.

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Plus the deliberate walking back into danger, certain death for what?, an ideal, love.............or just plain tired to the point of death.

Bravo for catching the similarities. !!!!!

 

[pontalba]

Sonia had a very strong reaction to Martin's disappearance. Stronger than her earlier interaction with Martin would have led me to expect. She is, after all the one that warned him about talking to everyone about the adventure. Once the suspicion flame is lit..... could she, would she?

 

[Peder]

Plus the deliberate walking back into danger, certain death for what?, an ideal, love.............or just plain tired to the point of death.

Pontalba,
I think those are questions that can very fairly be directed at the book. I preferred to think that his clandestine project was like all the other challenges before -- something to succeed at in hope of getting the girl. However, I'm not convinced that is what VN meant, because we see Martin resolving to enter Russia with a newer grim determination essentially in revenge for the violation of Irina. That could be argued to be the real and more noble reason, doing it for someone else, rather than for his own personal benefit of impressing Sonia. I can't argue against that, especially as it is stated there in black and white and can portray Martin ultimately as both noble and brave. It just seems tacked on to me, though, after a major section of the book shows him gearing up for the mission for completely different reasons. So I think it is very murky what he thought he was doing, or even what Nabokov thought he was doing. And maybe that argues for a third rereading to get things still clearer. /groaning is heard/

I simply picked an ending, from out of the uncertainty, that appealed to me
Peder

 

[Peder]

Sonia had a very strong reaction to Martin's disappearance. Stronger than her earlier interaction with Martin would have led me to expect. She is, after all the one that warned him about talking to everyone about the adventure. Once the suspicion flame is lit..... could she, would she?

Indeed, Pontalba,
Once the suspicion flame is lit .... anything is possible?
I take it you mean she felt very bad because she realized she herself had spoken of his mission with someone(s) in violation of her own advice? I hadn't thought of that, thinking of Gruzinov as the most likely suspect of all. But there are no clues suggesting that either of them, or anyone else, had anything to do with betraying him, either deliberately or by accident. At least none that I saw. Romantic me, I just took her inconsolable crying as belatedly revealing deeper feelings for him than she realized she had. So that finally she grieved for him, as he would have hoped, and appreciated, but never got to see. A fitting sorrow for the fallen warrior.

Peder

 

[pontalba]

Indeed, Pontalba,
I take it you mean she felt very bad because she realized she herself had spoken of his mission with someone(s) in violation of her own advice? .....But there are no clues suggesting that either of them, or anyone else, had anything to do with betraying him, either deliberately or by accident.

Something along those lines. No, I agree there are no outright clues, only possibilities. Sonia did lie to Martin about being out with Bubnov. Now its entirely possible that was only what it appeared to be on the surface, a sexual indiscretion. In another light, it could be more.
Remember the times in which the book was written. All was possible, betrayers left and right. (no pun intended) Just as Bubnov used the events to hand in his writing, so did Nabokov.

Just noodling..........

 

[Peder]

Something along those lines. No, I agree there are no outright clues, only possibilities. Sonia did lie to Martin about being out with Bubnov. Now its entirely possible that was only what it appeared to be on the surface, a sexual indiscretion. In another light, it could be more.
Remember the times in which the book was written. All was possible, betrayers left and right. (no pun intended) Just as Bubnov used the events to hand in his writing, so did Nabokov.

Just noodling..........

Pontalba,
Once again your thoughts go deeper than mine. I hadn't thought of the possibility at all. But while I say "no evidence," Sonia's remark about not talking about it, and the existence of Gruzinov himself are evidence enough that the posibility of espionage was part of the life of the emigres. Espionage has been with us since time immemorial, and -- just guessing -- as you suggest, it may well have been part of everyone's consciousness (and guarded talk) in the emigre communuty. So, yes indeed, you must be right that many things were not as they appeared on the surface, either in that community or in the novel. Though I know little of the history, the battle between Whites and Reds went on for a while after the Revolution -- the White army is mentioned in the novel -- and subversion across the border probably lasted at least as long, considering the hostility of the west toward communism right from the beginning. So your thoughts certainly fit in among realistic possibilities. I wonder how often political activism/subversion/espionage appear in VN novel's. Continuing to read them I guess is one good way to find out. He wrote a detective story (Sebastian Knight) but, not to my knowledge (yet) a spy story. Drat!
Peder

 

[pontalba]

I'd certainly not started to think along those lines except for your post regarding The Spy Who Came in From the Cold. But once that idea was planted......all sorts of possibilities came to light.

When I read the end of Glory it immediately reminded me of another famous novel, and as I have thought about it, I am further reminded of a historical spy story with a similar ending. With three examples now, it almost gets to sound like a standard ending.

 

[Peder]

I'd certainly not started to think along those lines except for your post regarding The Spy Who Came in From the Cold. But once that idea was planted......all sorts of possibilities came to light.

Well, Pontalba,
That's the best reason I know for these forums.
We all end up seeing things that none of us saw before.
Plus of course the coffee and Danish.
Peder

 

[Peder]

Well, Pontalba,
That's the best reason I know for these forums.
We all end up seeing things that none of us saw before.
Plus of course the coffee and Danish.
Peder

Pontalba,
I have to say there are scenes that seem strange to me in the relationship between Martin and Sonia, and maybe they make more sense to you. The scenes occur after the first time Martin visits Sonia and his mother and the Zilanovs.(p138)

The first time Martin visited them and saw their cheap dingy flat, consisting of four rooms and a kitchen, where a strange Sonia with a different hairdo sat on the table, swinging her legs in their darned up stockings, sniffling and peeling potatoes, Martin realized that he could expect nothing but sorrows from Sonia.

True enough! The story then continues and leads to the hilarious account of Bubnov putting down a young poet (p141):

..[Bubnov] muttered in hollow tones with a sigh, "That stuff is all wrong, all unnecessary," and dejectedly shook his head; upon which, abruptly, with vivd enthusiasm, he would thunder out a poem by Pushkin. Once when a young poet took offense and objected, "That's by Pushkin, and this is by me," Bubnov thought for a moment and replied, "Still, yours is worse."

But in between, Martin actually sees quite a bit of Sonia (p139, 143)

Evenings of a quite different nature followed -- a multitude of guests, dancing to records, dancing in a nearby cafe, the murk of the corner cinema. New people materialized around Martin on all sides, nebulae gave birth to new worlds. Definite labels and features were found for the Russian substance scattered all around Berlin, be it merely a snatch of routine conversation amid the shoving sidewalk crowd ....


But Sonia, ah Sonia, -----From his nighttime thoughts about the glorious and dark expedition, from his literary chats with Bubnov, from his daily labors at the tennis club, he would return to her again and again and hold a match over the gas stove for her, whereupon, with a loud gush, the blue flame would extend its claws...

In fact one evening, when Martin abandoned all caution and began to speak of Horace, Sonia actually said to him

"You're such a dear...that I have to kiss you -- wait let's go over there'"

And she does. plus she also tells him she has someone else, and Martin is left to muse that "She did the same to Darwin."

My wonderment is why Nabokov went so far out of his way to portray a growing friendship and comfort in each other's company, to only replay Sonia's jilting of Darwin, which we already know about. Bubnov could have been worked into the story without also working in a potentially growing romance between Martin and Sonia, only to destroy it (again).

Something tells me it has to have some meaning (since this is Nabokov), the other side of me tells me it is needless extra baggage for the story (which is hard to believe for Nabokov).

And for myself it is yet one more indication that Martin and Sonia had a natural 'fit' which I am disappointed did not develop into a growing relationship and romance. But I guess maybe this novel is an anti-romance. It is so frustrating.

Oh well,
Not everything is illuminated,
Peder

 

[pontalba]

There are women that try to blame all dastardly deeds in relationships, or would be relationships on men. Men in general. As a dyed in the wool real live woman I say "it ain't so." Unreliability and treachery are not gender based character aspects.

That said, I have to say that Sonia was a "user". Someone that will get what they can out of a person, drop them, and go on to the next victim, er, person. As shown by your exerpts on p.138, they lived in a poor manner. Not uncomfortable really, simply as it says -- dingy. That was not Sonia's cuppa. No, she was not terribly successful in her targets, but after all she was limited in just who she could approach and how far she could go without recrimination of the community and family. IMO, she kept going back to Martin inbetween because she really did like him, but figured he would never amount to anything much and didn't want to tie herself to what she considered a loser. Thus her anger and collapse when he went missing.
I also strongly feel that she spilled Martin's beans to someone. Thus her guilt.

 

[Peder]

That said, I have to say that Sonia was a "user". Someone that will get what they can out of a person, drop them, and go on IMO, she kept going back to Martin inbetween because she really did like him, but figured he would never amount to anything much and didn't want to tie herself to what she considered a loser. Thus her anger and collapse when he went missing.
I also strongly feel that she spilled Martin's beans to someone. Thus her guilt.

Pontalba,
Hm! You're great! I had the vague feeling that Martin was her fall-back position and it vaguely crossed my mind when she cried so at his loss. But you definitely put it better than I could! She definitely didn't mind being friendly with and dating at least two men at a time, and I wonder just how that colored Nabokov's or readers' views at the time, and also in the emigre community at that. Possibly had some of the qualities of a lead balloon? The only (ancient) American term that comes to my mind is 'fast.'
Hm!
Peder

PS And yes I would think that she felt extremely guilty at his loss, at least because she really 'knew' what he was up to and didn't stop him (as if she could have), but a feeling of guilt would trigger such immediate and deep sobs as that, especially if she liked him even a little.
P

 

[pontalba]

PS And yes I would think that she felt extremely guilty at his loss, at least because she really 'knew' what he was up to and didn't stop him (as if she could have), but a feeling of guilt would trigger such immediate and deep sobs as that, especially if she liked him even a little.
P

Ah, but I think she actually could have stopped him. And yes, as soon as she collapsed in sobs, I knew it was a guilty conscience. If she had told Martin that she really did in fact love him...I think....I hope that could have done the trick. He at least would have thought long and hard about leaving her.

So Martin's mothers fears that Sonia did not love Martin enough were in fact valid.

 

[Peder]

Ah, but I think she actually could have stopped him. And yes, as soon as she collapsed in sobs, I knew it was a guilty conscience. If she had told Martin that she really did in fact love him...I think....I hope that could have done the trick. He at least would have thought long and hard about leaving her.

So Martin's mothers fears that Sonia did not love Martin enough were in fact valid.

Pontalba,
How do you do it?
Yes absolutely! If, as I suggested he was doing it to get the girl, then absolutely correct! If she had loved him and said so, then he would presumably have achieved his goal and lived happily ever after with her. (We can hope!) You are definitely ahead two goals to nil .... unless you have scored another goal or two, while I wasn't looking. Even if he had been doing it for idealistic reasons, as may have been the case at the end, she might still have prevailed as a practical matter by offering her genuine love and convincing him of the futility of his mission.
Make that three goals to nil.
....and Toes!
Peder

 

[pontalba]

Ah, but you are the one that insisted it was a boy wants girl, boy doesn't get girl, boy goes off on dangerous adventure......and in the end, you were right. Mr. He-who-makes-correct-analysis-of-situation-and provides-framework. I hung some sheetrock, thats all. Maybe a bit of plastering.

 

[Peder]

Ah, but you are the one that insisted it was a boy wants girl, boy doesn't get girl, boy goes off on dangerous adventure......and in the end, you were right. Mr. He-who-makes-correct-analysis-of-situation-and provides-framework. I hung some sheetrock, thats all. Maybe a bit of plastering.

Pontalba,
Credit where credit is due goes to you, I think, because you saw the house when I only saw the frame. But, if you wish, we can split it and call it synergy, which again is what these discussions are all about.
And BTW I can't plaster worth beans.
Peder

 

[pontalba]

There was a scene in a Clint Eastwood movie...can't remember the name, but he played a policeman bringing a witness back to Las Vegas, the blonde that in real life he ended up marrying, anyhow....OH! It was The Gauntlet!
Anyhow, my point, and I do have a point.... ....is that finally when they got back to Vegas, he was shot, and there he is on the ground bleeding, and she's busy shaking him asking if he is alive.....he looks up at her and in a very marytered tone says...."nag, nag, nag...".

So. If you insist, yes, I'll take some of the credit.

I know,I know....it doesn't have much to do with the subject, I just love the story! LOLOL

 

[Peder]

That's cute, Pontalba! I like the story too, now that I have heard it.
/chuckling/
Peder