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King's Dark Tower Series - For those who have completed it *SPOILERS*

Libra6Poe

New Member
Questions? I'll try.

When the Tower is powerful and has been saved, why would time "reset" like this? No doubt the Crimson King etc will suddenly wink back into existence, and round we go again. To me, this does not make sense.
I suppose I haven't thought about that really. It does't make sense to me either. I'll ask Lenny. :eek:
Why does Roland have to earn redemption for what he has done? The things he did were all to ensure the success of his quest, ie to save the Dark Tower and all the worlds at all costs. The Dark Tower wanted and needed to be saved, so why punish Roland for doing what had to be done? If he had not done these things, the quest would have failed and the tower and all the worlds would have ended.
I'm not sure if I've mentioned this before, but in Bev Vincent's book The Road to the Dark Tower, he mentions this Hitchikers' Guide to the Galaxy game. In the game, no matter what you do, you can't win unless you give this dog a sandwich.

Perhaps Roland had to pick up the horn of Eld, stay true to his lineage, etc... to complete the quest.

But if Roland's quest ever did end, what would happen to the Tower, given that it seems to need the quest to continue? Would the duty pass to someone else?
Although it appears that way, I'm not sure if it needs a quest to continue. Maybe the Tower is like God, showing individuals the right path (showing Roland a way to find love, meaning to his existence), and if these people screw up, they have to try again.

It seems like it's the Tower that needs to be saved, but really, it's everyone else that needed to be saved. Eddie would've died as a junkie like his brother, Susannah probably would've died too continuing on as Detta, and Jake needed to find someone that would truly love him - as a child needs to be loved, and Oy would've died in the Wastelands. Roland put the Tower before everything else in his life. Before it even needed to be saved, he sacrificed everything.

::shrug:: I don't know. Maybe. :eek:

On Roland's next quest, will the "three" he draws still be Susannah, Eddie and Jake, or versions of them? Or will they be three completely new people?
I was thinking that maybe what we read wasn't the first time they were drawn. They all had it in them, they were all gunslingers to begin with when Roland drew them. Perhaps it was like deja-vu to them, they had all been there before... and perhaps they really were... you know?
 

Libra6Poe

New Member
The introduction of The Artist was very contrived and rather unsatisfying. He is discovered, and lo and behold, he happens to have this wondrous talent that saves everything! Then he wanders off again and King blithely says that he doesn't know what happens to him.
Agreed (on all of it really). I feel the same way about Roland's son as well. The story had been building for a long time... and he didn't turn out to be much of a threat. It almost seemed like King meant there to be something more for him, but opted out.

::whew:: finally. I'm so sorry it took so long Halo. :eek:
Oh, I meant to ask you your thoughts on the turtle. I meant to say more earlier... I'll get back to it.
 

sirmyk

New Member
Libra6Poe said:
I meant to ask you your thoughts on the turtle. I meant to say more earlier... I'll get back to it.
The turtle was somewhat descibed in It, although you'll have to scrub the thousand pages or so to find these tidbits. It doesn't rid of the confusion though. It's amazing how most of King's works are connected in subtle ways.
 

Halo

New Member
Lovely to hear your thoughts, Libra. :)

Libra6Poe said:
I wonder why he was shown all these things as he climbed the tower. Perhaps to repeat his quest over and over while at the same time learning. I wonder how many times he had already gone through his quest before we were introduced into that world?

But I don't see how he can learn, when he can't remember his past mistakes. People learn from experience, and yet Roland starts his quest each time with his memory wiped, so how can he learn and change his actions?

Libra6Poe said:
It seems like it's the Tower that needs to be saved, but really, it's everyone else that needed to be saved. Eddie would've died as a junkie like his brother, Susannah probably would've died too continuing on as Detta, and Jake needed to find someone that would truly love him - as a child needs to be loved, and Oy would've died in the Wastelands. Roland put the Tower before everything else in his life. Before it even needed to be saved, he sacrificed everything.

A very interesting point. I agree with you about the characters needing to be saved. I suppose the Quest and the love of the others in the ka-tet saves them in a way.

Libra6Poe said:
Maybe the Tower is like God, showing individuals the right path (showing Roland a way to find love, meaning to his existence), and if these people screw up, they have to try again.

Possibly... And yet, the Tower seems to be there just for Roland - he knows he has to approach/enter it alone, the rooms show his life. Why would the Tower/God be so concerned with how one individual lives his life? What makes Roland so important in the whole scheme of things? Unless there are others who also approach the Tower, see their lives in the rooms etc. :confused:

About the turtle in It - I read it so long ago that I can't remember the turtle at all. Sorry! :eek:
 

Libra6Poe

New Member
But I don't see how he can learn, when he can't remember his past mistakes. People learn from experience, and yet Roland starts his quest each time with his memory wiped, so how can he learn and change his actions?
Hmm... maybe it's not that he learns, but that he still does something different. Maybe he'll do the right thing and he'll be able to rest.
Like, although he doesn't remember being there before, he'll still do something different.

Have you seen 50 First Dates with Adam Sandler and Drew Barrymore?
kind of
Drew doesn't remember anything from the previous day, so everyday she does the same thing: go to this diner. And although she doesn't remember, it doesn't mean her actions are always the same. She builds a house made of waffles everyday, but it's not the same structure. -okay, I worded that horribly, ugh. :eek:
 

Halo

New Member
Libra6Poe said:
Hmm... maybe it's not that he learns, but that he still does something different. Maybe he'll do the right thing and he'll be able to rest.
Like, although he doesn't remember being there before, he'll still do something different.

I see what you're saying, and I agree it's a possibility, certainly. But I don't think Roland would do things differently, purely because he has this unshakeable belief that he is doing the right thing to save the Tower. Because he believes this, he is not going to act any differently. (After all, his quest is a "success" - he reaches and enters the Tower, thus saving all the worlds.) Only learning from experience could make him change his actions, but because he is never permitted to remember, surely he is forever doomed to repeat his mistakes? Well, that's my opinion, anyway!

I guess the Tower/Gan/Ka/whatever could make some subtle changes which might steer Roland along a different course, like him picking up the Horn of Eld, but that is all so random, it's not as if Roland is earning his redemption as King suggests he has to, it would just be events manipulating him. Hmm. :confused: :D
 

mrkgnao

New Member
Remember, this is a spoiler-full thread

On the last day of the month with a turtle on the wall calendar (say true!) I finished The Dark Tower.

I loved the ending. Or rather, I loved Roland's ending, less thrilled about Susannah's. (I had thought that maybe E, S, J and O would end up meeting in the clearing at the end of the path...) Of course Roland quests on. He still savours the "bitter romance of the quest", right? :rolleyes: Also, his quest wasn't to save the tower, but to reach it and climb to the top. That he had to save the beams in order for the tower still to be there for him to reach was just another chore, as he told the Tet corporation. Not sure the horn will change anything, any more than the recurring quests ever change. It's a symbol of the Eld and of the quest in itself, isn't it?

I liked the inclusion of the character Stephen King, as I always like what the smarmy academics (=me) call metafiction.

A lot of times I thought of a Kurt Vonnegut book, where KV puts asterisks in front of the names of ppl who are about to die. There was a lot of "And he'd never see him alive again" and "He would regret that bitterly later". A bit too much, even.

Generally speaking, the last book could have been shorter. My favourite was The gunslinger, partly because it was so... shall we say ambient? And mysterious. I liked it that it was unclear whether it was our world or another, e.g. But it's good the later books were quicker reads, or I'd still be somewhere in the middle ;)

I agree that e.g. Mordred and The Artist were just "dipped in" too briefly, but on the other hand, could the series be longer? :p

And another thought: you think Gan is an acronym for "Great American Novel"? I've used it as that, but it could be a coincidence of course... :rolleyes:

In conclusion as they say, I really liked it (and I loved Roland). But I don't think I'll read any more King. There are better wordslingers (I thought about calling him a Big Word-Hunter, but that wouldn't be nice :p ) out there.

*mrkgnao*
 

lies

New Member
I only picked up Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower a month or so ago (after a hiatus of god knows how many years) and must say I was a bit disappointed by both novels. I did think King managed to redeem himself a bit with his first ending, but I just had to laugh at the second.

Now back to post # 1 of this thread for a relaxed read-through.
 

-Carlos-

New Member
I understand that the book, Bag of Bones describes a little of what the number 19 means. As for me I loved the series and look forward to re-reading it again soon.
 

Mike123

kickbox
*Hope this isn't necroposting...But it's the most recent topic I could find*

Personally I was really dissappointed with the ending, Roland must reset his quest again and again. The only time I've been as disappointed with a book is His Dark Materials by Phillip Pullman.

First off, Eddie's death. This was the worst death. He died for no point whatsoever. Other than to distance Susannah and the other 2(3 including Oy). The whole Dandelo thing seemed to me a reason to make the book longer. Had this not happened King, as clever as he is, would have easily found a way to bring "The Artist" into the story.

The Crimson King resembling Father Christmas? What is the point in that? Seriously. Red Robes fair enough. But King didn't put enough thought. I bet he was looking at a picture of Santa at the time he wrote that part.

The Tower itself. Why would the whole point of existence be Dark? My speculation at first was that the Crimson King had tainted it somehow. Or that the beams weakening would have caused the tower to darken. But this is all mere speculation.

King bringing himself into the book seemed really smuggish to me. Characters should reflect off a writers nature. But never should the writer bring themselves into the book.
The books were amazing. Aside from Song Of Susannah I have almost nothing to say against the first 6. But the last was my least favourite easily.

"My first and last thought, was that King lied in every word"
 

hockeycop

New Member
Not sure if this thread is still active, so I won't say much for now other than I can't believe so many people think the DT series is great. I hope everyone doesn't come down on me for that comment. I've read many King novels and short stories, and still remain a fan.

I thought The Gunslinger was the best book in the series. Roland's childhood and his pursuit of the man in black should’ve been the stuff of legend, but the series started to fizzle for me right from the moment he met Eddie in The Drawing of the Three.

Also, I thought the ending was a cop-out. How long did King take with the series, 30 years? And at the end Roland is in a perpetual loop. I know he he has the horn of Eld to start his journey again, but that hardly a 'WOW'. I gave the book a drop kick when I finished it. The only good thing I can say about the series is at least I didn’t buy the hardcovers.
 

Libra6Poe

New Member
I don't know. I think the series as a whole is pretty great. I can see how there are moments that suck when you look at them individually.

I know what you mean, there were a lot of disappointing and ridiculous parts, but in the end I was happy.
 

angerball

Active Member
I loved the ending!! My favourites are the first 4 books. Everything since Wolves of the Calla was a disappointment, moreso because I had been waiting for so long for them. :(
 

hockeycop

New Member
I loved the ending!! My favourites are the first 4 books. Everything since Wolves of the Calla was a disappointment, moreso because I had been waiting for so long for them. :(

I thought Wolves of the Calla was good too, especially the ending. The problem I have with the story as a whole is that it's all build-up, and no delivery. It's clear that King had no clear vision from the beginning on where the story was going.

Anyway, I still remain a King fan. I even read Lisey's Story last year.
 

lenny nero

New Member
Check it out:
At a book signing for his new novel, Under the Dome, Stephen King said that he had “one more Dark Tower book to write.”

The S.K. message board followed up his announcement with the following details: “Stephen has given me permission to pass along that he has an idea for a new Dark Tower book, the working title of which will be The Wind Through The Keyhole. He has not yet started this book and anticipates that it will be a minimum of eight months before he is able to begin writing it.”

And Zach Dionne at GQ added: “King stated he will write another Dark Tower novel. It will center around supporting characters and revolve around some important events between Wizard and Glass and Wolves of the Calla.”

King also mentioned that HBO plans to make Under The Dome into a series and that he has written a script for Cell.
 

beer good

Well-Known Member
How'd it get burned?
How'd it get burned?
How'd it get burned how'd it get burned HOW'D IT GET BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURNED?!?
 
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